President-elect Donald Trump stunned the Pentagon and the broader defense world by nominating Fox News host Pete Hegseth to serve as his defense secretary, tapping someone largely inexperienced and untested on the global stage to take over the world’s largest and most powerful military.
What could go wrong?
It baffels me that the american people are so stupid to elect him a second time. And this time, like we see, there is not going to be guardrails agains him. He is only picking yes men. It wouldn’t supprise me if Pentagon tries to get him killed before he get to the oval office.
That would shock me. Sane people in power might piss and moan about him, but they never actually do anything about it.
At least there is no more arguing whether Trump represents the American people or not.
I genuinely believe that the ideological divide is far too wide in the US to be able to say that “America” believes this or that.
It’s not stupidity, it was a clear option between something the American people know does not work, and something that might work.
If the Biden/Harris status quo continued, beyond the genocide and other awfulness, the median American would die from COVID or other such disease at their desk at work in their 80s while still stressing about how 2/3rds their 5 figure paycheck goes to rent and 1/3rd goes to their 1200 kcal/day diet.
Maybe Trump fixes it, maybe Trump ends it, but that above ever enshittificated scenario does not happen.
It’s like making a meth empire when you’re diagnosed with stage 4 cancer while poor. Best case scenario is better than the best case scenario in the alternative choices.
t’s not stupidity, it was a clear option between something the American people know does not work, and something that might work.
There is no reasonable expectation that Trump would “work” for anyone outside of some very wealthy and grifters. So, yes, voting for Trump is stupid.
Accelerationists can fuck off.
Well there is no reasonable expectation that voting for Harris improves anything given her explicit statement she’s going to be just Biden in a wig.
When you present unreasonable choices, you get unreasonable decisions. To most people Trump isn’t the ultra competent, ultra intelligent, ultra evil fascist you guys have been propagandizing him as for the last decade.
He’s an incompetent version of a generic politician.
Well there is no reasonable expectation that voting for Harris improves anything given her explicit statement she’s going to be just Biden in a wig.
That’s not true!
She promised to be different by appointing Republicans🤣
“would you rather have nothing to eat, or poison?”
If you eat nothing, maybe you can figure out a better solution with your remaining time. If you eat poison, you’re probably going to be too sick (or dead) to improve things.
Trump is poison.
Also Biden did improve some things, so it’s less “nothing” and more “some crackers”. Sure, a full meal would be better.
That’s not the choice, especially if you’re Muslim or poor. The choice is the same cyanide you’ve been taking, but a higher dose; or arsenic.
Biden improved nothing for the working class, and has been actively hostile to Muslims.
Your false choice and inability to see how much people are suffering is why you lost, why your messaging just doesn’t resonate and infact turns people off of your party.
Most people care about their own survival and life. That’s it. If your corpo is hurting them as much or worse than the other corporate is hurting them, they’ll simply not choose your corpo to give power to.
I don’t think anyone but himself ever called Trump ultra intelligent or ultra competent
Really? Dems have been saying he’s going to dismantle the US, completely use the US military to eliminate his political opponents, that he has pages on pages of plans to change the US into a dictatorship and stop all future elections while eliminating the US Constitution. I mean really Dems have been attributing to him this massive grand plan that would require a master manipulator operating completely perfectly to accomplish.
He should nominate me as Supreme Commander of the US Armed Forces. I feel like I’d do a good job
Yeah, you might
Ahh yes the axe throwing guy
How have I figured out that we are under active Russian attack and takeover and the Pentagon hasn’t?
I’m not stunned. This is his plan.
Fun fact, in this kind of war, the last thing you do is tell the bad guys you know what they’re doing. That’s some Hollywood shit.
Yeah but dude you also don’t let it get this far …
Whatever will please Trump’s Russian overlord.
Zionist*
Hey, Israel is a proxy state for the US. It doesn’t control the US that way.
Whatever you say, Maddow-pilled Russiagater.
Still erect even with the TV liar putting a TV liar in charge of your military?
Existentially stupid.
You say that like I should want the US military to be effective.
The military will be effective at what ever it’ll do. You should hope it maintains some sanity at least. Like a loaded gun won’t jam just because a crazy person picked it up.
Wrong. Give an ape a gun. They’re just as likely to kill themselves as anyone else.
Right…i think the metaphor train has derailed here.
What possible action do you think the military could be ordered to do, that will harm its capability to wage war, and will not result in even more innocent people getting killed than the regular levels of evil? Or is this a ‘acceptable collateral damage as long as its not me’ type of thing?
Privatize everything and lay off all government employees. Let the Department of War be run by the lowest bidder.
Disband 20% of it’s career leadership.
Zero out pentagon funding.
Withdraw from NATO.
Be optimistic, he might accidentally destroy it.
Some comments are dumb enough to get a user block after just one comment!
- Wall Street Journal: Mueller Doesn’t Find Trump Campaign Conspired With Russia
- Jacobin: Democrats and Mainstream Media Were the Real Kremlin Assets
- Washington Post: FEC fines DNC, Clinton for violating rules in funding Steele dossier
- Washington Post: Russian trolls on Twitter had little influence on 2016 voters
- Jacobin: It Turns Out Hillary Clinton, Not Russian Bots, Lost the 2016 Election
- Matt Taibbi: Move Over, Jayson Blair: Meet Hamilton 68, the New King of Media Fraud The Twitter Files reveal that one of the most common news sources of the Trump era was a scam, making ordinary American political conversations look like Russian spywork
- Jacobin: Why the Twitter Files Are in Fact a Big Deal On the Left, there’s been a temptation to dismiss the revelations about Twitter’s internal censorship system that have emerged from the so-called Twitter Files project. But that would be a mistake: the news is important and the details are alarming.
- MSNBC Repeats Hamilton 68 Lies 279 Times in 11 Minutes
- Jeff Gerth at Columbia Journalism Review on Russiagate: Editor’s Note | Part one | Part two | Part three | Part four
- Matt Taibbi: WMD, Part II: CIA “Cooked The Intelligence” To Hide That Russia Favored Clinton, Not Trump In 2016
- Chris Hedges: Why Russiagate Won’t Go Away
“Stunned”? Were they not paying attention last time he was president?
I’m sure this guy will say “great idea sir!” When Trump suggests nuking a hurricane…
Or Iran.
I’m not stunned by anything the orange turd does, I was paying attention the last eight years. Just making me madder and madder.
I will be stunned if he ever acts like a decent human being. Hasn’t happened yet.
The dude who admitted on national tv to never washing his hands? Lmao
greatest country on earth baybee
Death to America
Reality TV schlop hosts all down the line.
I prefer:
America is dead; long live America
long live America
Death to America
Well the last one withheld Afghanistan troop numbers from him, and there were reports Mark Milley staged somewhat of a soft coup as chairman of the joint chiefs. Trump’s gonna be paranoid about bringing in anyone already embedded in these departments.
Those heroes did what America needed to keep the filthy traitor from getting more American intelligence killed off.
This time the traitor will be able to kill Americans for his real bosses with zero impunity. Congrats magats.
They literally committed treason on behalf of the defense industry.
Nope. They did their part to try and save America from the enemy within.
Unfortunately that treasonous enemy is back and is now carrying out its final attack to finish destroying America.
That enemy is a duly elected representative. They are required to follow any order he gives that isn’t illegal.
Their duty is to the constitution of the United States. Not to the traitor who tried to destroy it.
And they were in violation of the constitution.
No. Traitor trump was and continues to be. That filthy waste of human life and his despicable magat nazis are the enemies of the United States and everything it was founded on.
The traitor won the popular vote and is the presumptive winner of the electoral college vote.
The constitution isn’t going to save us from this second Trump term.
Also it’s hilarious you’re pretending that a fucking faux newz host is somehow a valid fucking choice for anyone except the enemies of the United States.
Eminently stunnable people, these Pentagon beings
A tiny sliver of hope.
I know the sorts of oaths I had to take when I was in the military. I didn’t really enjoy my time there and I still took them seriously.
Those folks at the Pentagon, I would hope, are the sort that take them very seriously. And it is your duty to refuse unlawful orders.
If there’s enough “good ones” left, we might see some resistance coming from that area.
I wouldn’t hold out too much hope. They’re also preparing to purge the military leadership:
I’ve been out a long time and was of low rank in any case. However, I’m skeptical that safeguards don’t exist that will make that less effective than it sounds. For one thing, the duty to disobey unlawful orders goes all the way to the lowest E1. But I am doubtful that Trump can successfully reach a point where all or even enough of the top brass are willing to drink his flavor aid to not have to worry about them.
The orders aren’t unlawful though. Unlawful per who?
It’s generally called a “duty to disobey,” and is empowered by the Uniform Code of Military Justice. The UCMJ is more concerned about the need to obey orders, but specifies the conditions when military personnel may feel justified in not following them:
If the order is “contrary to the constitution” or “the laws of the United States.”
If the order is “patently illegal, … such as one that directs the commission of a crime.”
https://www.findlaw.com/legalblogs/law-and-life/what-is-a-military-duty-to-disobey/
They’re unlawful until the SCROTUS says they aren’t.
duty to disobey unlawful orders
How often does this happen?
How often does this happen?
Dunno, but an awful lot has been written about it. We don’t elect dictators very often, so I’d say we’re in uncharted waters here.
https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=soliders+who+have+disobeyed+unlawful+orders&ia=web
Basically never. Most aren’t getting to their day in court for disobeying orders. They’ll give you a less than honorable discharge quick fast and in a hurry. Back when I was in Don’t Ask Don’t Tell was still a thing, and was used to keep people quiet. I was threatened with it when reporting a sexual assault that leadership wanted to ignore. When I kept going up the chain of command I was eventually told if I didn’t shut up Id I’d be given a less than honorable discharge under violating Don’t Ask Don’t Tell.
Lore accurate Jonestown reference? NICE
😁
I literally had kool aid typed because that’s what everyone is used to hearing. Then I thought of the number of times I’ve said “Well ackshually” to others about that, so decided to heed my own pedantry.
I like how the expression is starting to morph into “He drank the Well Actually It Was Flavor-Aid.”
And since the only good reason to make the error would be to invite another pedant into the conversation, I’m finding this whole little sidethread very satisfactory.
For one thing, the duty to disobey unlawful orders goes all the way to the lowest E1.
History has shown that these are very seldom adhered to, and that adhering to them is a career-limiting—and even freedom-limiting—move. The whole War on Terror torture regime is just one example in the post-WWII era.
Is this the same US military that killed a million Iraqis or are you thinking of some alternate different US military
You see killing americans is icky until they are “the enemy” and I dont think the military is dedicated to internal struggles since no one is a real threat to power.
I have a different hope, that Trump will ruin their actual offensive capacity and save the world from the Pentagon. The US can not be trusted with its own military.
But they protected me from all those menacing children in Laos that didn’t even know the USA existed!
I don’t fail to appreciate your viewpoint, but while such a military exists, I’d like stopping 21st century Hitler before he can get started to be a service they provide.
Oh, so the US military should intervene in the Palestinian genocide on the side of Palestine, right? And then pay reparations to Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, and all the other places the US has slaughtered in the past 20 years alone.
The military is already struggling to recruit and moves like this will only delegitimize our military even more. I’m sure they’ll always be able to find goons to wield guns, but it will cease to be a respectable career path for all but the most right-wing citizenry.
It’s not all bad.
Ah yes, having a hollow military has worked so well throughout history
The military is already struggling to recruit
This can be improved by worsening working class conditions and increased jingoism, which will almost certainly happen.
goons to wield guns
Such as Hegseth?
That seems to be all he was when he was enlisted.
😂
21st century hitler? Who are we talking about, bush? Biden? Netenyahu?
The US military will go to Putin. Can Putin be trusted with the US military?
🤡
You really need to stop watching Maddow, Morning Joe, and the other Russiagate conspiracy theorists, because this sounds about as unhinged as QAnon conspiracy theorists.
The US can not be trusted with its own military.
I’m not a fan of U.S. foreign policy. But as far as the military chain of command, it’s specifically designed to have it’s own checks and balances against abuse of power. Precisely what Trump is wanting to topple. So if the choice is an orange toddler or a robust and effective circle of generals, I’ll go with the generals thanks.
The same US military that promises to bomb The Hague if it is ever held accountable for crimes against humanity?
Those checks and balances didn’t stop them from butchering a million Iraqis.
An orange toddler breaks his toys. Fuck em
I don’t disagree, but that’s not really my point.
What you’re arguing is basically akin to people who sat out the vote because “Genocide Joe”. Which is what gave America Trump 2.0 in the first place. Yes, the established Military Complex is flawed and in some cases downright evil. But the response to that isn’t “fuck it, let’s burn it down and give a fucking toddler direct control of it.”
You don’t fix things by picking the worse option on purpose. That’s utter lunacy.
It’s not flawed, it’s been working exactly as it was intended our entire lives. Unless you were alive for WW2, the purpose of the military has been to spread misery and death. I’d call it one of the most evil institutions in the face of the Earth.
I’m not optimistic. Trump won’t be allowed to destroy the military. He will weaken it, though, and that can only be a good thing.
Hence, saving the world from the Pentagon.
Trump won’t be allowed to destroy the military. He will weaken it, though, and that can only be a good thing.
Real 1930s Germany vibes coming out today
I’ve read a lot of stuff on the development of the military industrial complex in Germany and fascism’s relationship to it both while it was gaining power and had power and I’m not seeing any parallels, could you explain?
You don’t fix things by picking the worse option on purpose.
That’s exactly what the electorate just did.
That’s utter lunacy.
I fully agree
I can’t wait until his son’s begin an arms manufacturing company and get hundreds of billions in defense contracts and then entire companies of troops get owned in war when their guns spontaneously explode in their face and the tanks rounds detonates prior to firing. Capitalist efficiency!
This is how we are checkmated into civil war OR Putin takeover.
Either we let Trump/Elon stay in office and Putin takes over that way. Before Jan 20, they will all be releasing increasingly inflammatory information to incite a civil war. If we don’t go to war, Putin will finish taking us over and will have access to our resources and military. With that he will literally take over the world.
Ahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaa ahahahahahahahah hahahahahaaaaaaaahahaaaaaaaaaaa
This guy seemed to be campaigning on not prosecuting war criminals, so military lawyers might be the first ones with difficult decisions to make.
What country did you serve for? AFAIK, the US is one of a handful of countries that don’t have a law stating that soldiers are obligated to refuse unlawful orders and to report those who gave those orders.
It’s generally called a “duty to disobey,” and is empowered by the Uniform Code of Military Justice. The UCMJ is more concerned about the need to obey orders, but specifies the conditions when military personnel may feel justified in not following them:
If the order is “contrary to the constitution” or “the laws of the United States.”
If the order is “patently illegal, … such as one that directs the commission of a crime.”
https://www.findlaw.com/legalblogs/law-and-life/what-is-a-military-duty-to-disobey/
Appreciate it, I remember reading many years ago that after WW2, most countries agreed to sign into law that soldiers were legally obligated to disobey unlawful orders and report the person who gave the order to their superiors, but that the US was one of the nations that didn’t.
But a quick search brings up nothing but articles talking about what you posted, so I can’t find any info on it. I wonder if in other countries it’s enshrined outside of military law, and that’s the distinction? I have no clue.
